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Up Topic General / Letters and Opinions / Just Another Mass Shooting. Vent I Guess or Whatever.
- - By N70SAK Date 2018-11-08 8:32 AM
:mutmad: Because this country doesn't have an obsession with guns and violence.
Parent - By blazer85 [us] Date 2018-11-08 9:42 AM
Angry white men with guns.:sad:

If you are angry, please lock your gun up.....that is all I ask.
- - By Mookiethedog Date 2018-11-08 10:13 AM
After Sandy Hook I thought that was so shocking the status quo wouldn't be tolerated but.....

Not sure what the answer is....but if I could, I would cap spending on elections or have a percentage of it diverted to mental health. 

Meanwhile more people slaughtered and the survivors traumatized for life on various levels
Parent - - By elmtree Date 2018-11-08 11:02 AM
Without evidence that this person was mentally ill, while that would be nice, it isn't the solution here.  The solution here is gun control.
Parent - - By Mookiethedog Date 2018-11-08 12:49 PM
E.T.  yeah I wasn't suggesting mental health is the only issue at all. :hug:

I do believe with a population of 340 million (or whatever you have) with that many guns, it's only a matter of small fraction of percentages (mentally ill, people that hate, extremists etc) that you need for these types of events to occur.
So gun control would be a great solution to hopefully reduce the frequency.  At the same time the idea that more guns will protect people (armed guards at churches etc) is a solution some suggest.  The divide seems so huge I can't really get my head around it. 

The whole thing boggles my mind though how these events repeat themselves over and over and there isn't outrage.  The focus placed on the stereotype terrorists (ISIS etc) while important, should include putting resources financial and otherwise to make people safer domestically....by talking about it and being outraged that people are being slaughtered whatever the root cause/reason.

Anyway, it all makes me very sad.  I hate our species....but not in a violent way :hug:
Parent - By sideshowbob Date 2018-11-08 1:24 PM
I'm sure that folks in other countries have their share of mental health issues , but those countries have many fewer, if any, mass shootings. The difference --in the USA there are more guns that the total population , which means realistically there is no gun control.
Parent - - By BoredTemp [us] Date 2018-11-08 8:47 PM
I don't understand why guns can't be taken away in cases like this.  From the WSJ:

"Earlier this year, police were summoned to the home. Long was holed up inside; furniture was thrown around, neighbors said, and a bullet had been fired through the wall.

The street was blocked off, and police spent hours trying to get Long to peacefully come outside.

“They couldn’t get him out for a long time, like half the day,” said neighbor Richard Berge.

The Ventura County sheriff said in a briefing Thursday that deputies responded to a disturbance at the Longs’ home in April and mental-health specialists were dispatched. They determined that Long wasn’t a threat and didn’t qualify for an involuntary psychiatric hold."


This is not a person who should have weapons handy.
Parent - - By N70SAK Date 2018-11-09 6:57 AM
As well, officials can only take the guns they know about, and are willingly surrendered or found by searching.  And it's all too easy to buy a gun illegally or somewhere with few restrictions. :mutmad:

There's a lot of things that need to change in this culture from the way we care for psychiatric/psychologically challenged*, access to guns, and most difficultly, the belief that having a gun is a right and guns are "cool".

*I just decided the other day. I don't like the term mentally ill. we don't call people with physical disabilities the physically ill.
Parent - - By BoredTemp [us] Date 2018-11-09 7:54 AM
In this case - the gun was legally purchased and they knew he had one as there was a bullet hole in the wall, so knowing about it shouldn't have been too hard....

-------------

to your asterisk -

it's an interesting point.  "illness" implies something that can be cured where as "disability" is something that can be accommodated, but never cured.

thoughts?
Parent - By Tim [us] Date 2018-11-09 4:57 PM
I’ll jump in on the asterisk discussion. My late wife died via suicide. Before her mental illness symptoms surfaced, she was a fully capable adult. She had a master’s degree, several previous jobs with a high level of responsibility, was a good mom to our 3 kids, etc. To me, it feels like it disrespects the person she was if she’s referred to as “psychologically challenged”. I have no problem referring to her in her last years as mentally ill or suffering from mental illness. Just my gut feel. I’m open to further discussion.
Parent - - By oitsubob [us] Date 2018-11-09 12:25 PM
the belief that having a gun is a right

It is a right, not a belief, protected by the 2nd Amendment and affirmed by the SCOTUS. Read D.C. v. Heller and McDonald v. Chicago supreme court opinions.
Parent - - By N70SAK Date 2018-11-09 1:14 PM
No it's not. 2nd Amendment states only "arms". It does not specify, guns, bombs, knives, bows, cannons, chemicals, bacteria, sand, water, asteroids, protons, electric shock.........  Nor does it prohibit the STRICT regulation of machines that hurl dense masses at great velocity. What previous courts have ruled can be changed and damn well should be.  I still state that the 2nd amendment does not need to be changed or removed. It's firearms that clearly need to be regulated because too many people have demonstrated time and again that they cannot be responsible.  There needs to be certification, and strictly tracked registration, and insurance up the fucking ass! 

Anyone who still argues that gun ownership is a right, better have one fucking good explanation for their need. I did not used to feel this way.  I'm getting fucking fed up with this shit.
Parent - By oitsubob [us] Date 2018-11-09 3:45 PM
Where did I say anything about regulation? No where. All I said was that owning a gun is a right and that the SCOTUS has affirmed that right and then suggested 2 cases to you, one from 2008 and the other 2010. They were the first cases since 1934 that dealt specifically with the 2nd Amendment.

So chill out.
- By donnasaur [us] Date 2018-11-08 10:31 AM
i'm just sick over this. Every time. People lose their loved ones, their kids, their partners. There is no reason for this to be our reality, and for us to be complacent.
- - By N70SAK Date 2018-11-09 6:38 AM
And now there's another fucking fire in that area and it's Red Flag weather. :mutmad:
Parent - By N70SAK Date 2018-11-09 10:54 AM
The Oak Park/Thousand Oaks fire is out of control and marching to the sea.:mutmad:

And now a fire in Griffith Park is threatening the LA Zoo.  :mutmad:
Parent - - By N70SAK Date 2018-11-10 7:10 AM
"There is no reason for these massive, deadly and costly forest fires in California except that forest management is so poor. Billions of dollars are given each year, with so many lives lost, all because of gross mismanagement of the forests. Remedy now, or no more Fed payments!"

That's tweet from the fucking head fascist!!!  :mutmad: What the fuck is wrong with his country!?!?
Parent - - By oitsubob [us] Date 2018-11-10 7:21 AM
Are you upset because he may be right? Back in May 2018 Gov. Brown signed an EO to accelerate forest management efforts.
Parent - - By N70SAK Date 2018-11-10 7:45 AM
Try, over development in areas prone to wildfires and in an ever increasingly dry and hot environment thanks to ENVIRONMENTAL DESTRUCTION related to any number of industries; in particular good old fossil fuels.:mutmad: 

Look at the fucking picture I posted in the dailies. That is the edge of suburbia. That's not mismanaged forests. Multi-million dollar homes are not mismanaged forests.

P.S. A commom cuase for ignition of forest fires is careless use of firearms.

Tool. : pbbt:
Parent - By oitsubob [us] Date 2018-11-10 9:14 AM
Funny, National Park Service says that ~90% of all forest fires are human caused as a result of unattended campfires, burning of debris, discarded cigarettes, and arson. Don't see firearms in there, do you?
Parent - By gadget girl Date 2018-11-10 4:13 PM
bob, it could very well be that the forest management efforts are lacking.  However, the timing of his remarks is inappropriate given the fatalities and widespread destruction.  My colleague at the office, many friends and clients or mine have all been evacuated.  Definitely a very tense weekend here in So Cal.  :hug:
Up Topic General / Letters and Opinions / Just Another Mass Shooting. Vent I Guess or Whatever.

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