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Up Topic Communities / Women / Waning July Weekend Thread
- - By swandive Date 2018-07-28 8:48 AM
It's almost August and the kids here head back to school on 01 August. :shocker!:

Parent - By swandive Date 2018-07-28 8:52 AM
I ran 14 this morning.  I felt halfway decent for the first half the run, but by the end the heat and humidity were really getting to me.  Ugh.  Not a totally awful run, though.  I had hoped to get a nap, but it doesn't look as if that's going to happen given that I'm getting ready to head down to my grandmother's house to celebrate her birthday (which was a couple of days ago).  Nothing else too exciting planned for the weekend.
Parent - - By Zipper [us] Date 2018-07-28 10:37 AM
Hola! Ten mile bike ride this morning. Sunny, humid and almost cool this morning. Feels almost like fall.
Parent - By swandive Date 2018-07-28 4:32 PM
It feels like fall? :shocker!::cry:  I keep thinking about how it's not even August yet so it's a long time before the weather improves.
Parent - - By NotSoFast [ca] Date 2018-07-28 4:08 PM
And I thought we were early August 10!
Parent - - By swandive Date 2018-07-28 4:29 PM
I had a friend who posted pics of her kids on their first day of school earlier this week, so they started in July!  In fairness, the schools here start at the beginning of August but are done before Memorial Day and they have several random week-long breaks throughout the year.
Parent - By NotSoFast [ca] Date 2018-07-29 3:42 PM
eh its too hot to go outside and play or for camp. might as well get out early in May and enjoy the weather then.
Parent - - By swandive Date 2018-07-28 6:07 PM
So, I've been thinking about this a bit over the past day or so.  A family friend died of suicide early Friday morning.  I didn't particularly know him -- he was my parents' age and we only ever crossed paths at wedding and funerals - but he was related to close family friends.  Anyway, I know very little about his mental state, but I do know that his wife died of ALS a couple of years ago and one of his children died of leukemia about a decade ago.  He recently remarried, but from what I've heard third-hand, it was a possibly stormy relationship and he'd had a fight with his wife the night that he died, she left, and came home late at night to find him dead.  I have no idea if he was depressed or had showed signs of being suicidal, but it's not hard to imagine that he might have post traumatic stress-related depression at the very least. 

But what struck me was that my Mom's reaction was that he was "selfish" and that she couldn't believe he'd do this to his children.  My Dad, similarly, said he'd talked to him at a funeral several months ago and he didn't seem depressed.  Is this still the norm for how people react to suicide?  I know that, historically, mental illness has been seen as a personal failing, not as a real illness that can kill you, but the majority of my family has struggled with depression, so it's hard to understand how my parentsstill think that this man just didn't care about his family so he chose to selfishly kill himself and that's the only reasonable explanation.  I dunno, I guess I'm just venting but it is disheartening to experience this continued perception that mental illness isn't a "real" disease and that you only die of suicide if you suck as a person. {sigh}
Parent - By Arimathea [us] Date 2018-07-28 11:30 PM
I tend to have the same visceral reaction as your parents, though I try to remind  myself that mental illness is real and can be fatal. I think it has to do with having seen so many people who would have given anything for a few more years, months, or even weeks of life and who departed earlier than they wanted. But I can see your point also -- yes mental illness is an awful situation, and no suicide does not mean that the person committing it sucks.
Parent - - By classicsnerd [us] Date 2018-07-29 3:24 PM
such a hard issue. I think you are right - many people still struggle, on a visceral (like A said), if not on an intellectual, level, to think of suicide as a "real" illness, just as real as cancer or heart disease that took someone before they or their family/loved ones were ready. But mental illness is so real, and so painful, and suicidal thoughts are impossible to really understand unless you've experienced them yourself. "Choosing" to depart from this life is not something you do if unless the alternative - staying - is just too awful to contemplate any longer.

Parent - - By reebs (chicken whisperer) Date 2018-07-30 10:20 AM
"Choosing" to depart from this life is not something you do if unless the alternative - staying - is just too awful to contemplate any longer.

This is the interesting thing about suicide. We move toward supporting physician assisted suicide for folks with types of chronic pain or terminal illnesses.  I know that depression isn't, itself, terminal, but it is chronic pain.  And for some reason we fight against suicide in that case (before you jump to the wrong conclusion, I'm actually against physician assisted suicide, not for helping people who are depressed with suicide)
Parent - By classicsnerd [us] Date 2018-07-30 1:44 PM
yes, it is chronic pain. That says it well.
Parent - By Gunna [is] Date 2018-07-30 3:35 AM
I agree with you but I also have experience with depression and know how horrible it can be. It seems that people who commit suicide honestly believe that everybody would be better off without them, so no, not selfish. Everybody needs to remember that "depression lies"; it distorts how you think and makes you believe all kinds of stupid things. I've had some pretty awful times with depression but have never actually tried to kill myself so I can't even imagine how much pain somebody has to be in to do that. :sad: Of course it's still horrible for those left behind.
Parent - - By tritri Date 2018-07-30 9:23 AM
I've never heard anyone say anything about it being a selfish act.  But the element of choice is there, so yes, how can he/she do this to their family.  The ones left behind not only have grief, but the idea that they have not loved deeply enough, or somehow could have done something to prevent it.  This is going under the assumption that the choice was made while the person was in their right mind, ie rational.  That whole train of thought takes mental illness out of the occasion.  Even understanding mental illness, there is a huge dichotomy in trying to come to terms mentally and emotionally with suicide.  There is the aspect of dealing with your own feelings ("you hurt me, you chose this, I am sad and grieving", and really needing someone to blame.)  So there is a struggle of wanting to blame the person for your pain on the emotional side, while wanting to understand logically how this happened and came about, to be empathetic to the person who is no longer there to question or to soothe.   

  Most people really don't understand depression and understand suicide ideation even less.  It was a surprise to me to find out that suicide ideation was even a thing, much less something some people deal with without depression.  My sister says that most suicides are a spur decision, so not a lot of thought given, but more impulsive.  I am starting to believe that suicide ideation more closely resembles OCD than I would have thought.  She also works for Amgen and they were working on a medication and they were in clinical trials and found that it increased suicide ideation.  They stopped trials and didn't work on the drug after that.  The surprising thing was that the drug was for something entirely different (I think ulcers?  I can't remember), and did not cross the blood brain barrier.  So there is a lot to learn still on the medical front about what factors into suicide ideation.  I know that certain drugs for depression can increase suicide ideation in the young.  I recently learned that my cousin, who was 40, was on 2 different medications for depression, but that they were known as a suicide cocktail and were never to be prescribed together.  He committed suicide, leaving behind a wife and twin 12 year old boys.  So, yes, everyone was thinking, "How could he leave those kids?"  There is also the religious element, I am sure, where that is a mortal sin.  This all assumes it is a logical, rational choice and not what it really is.  People were also dismayed, as his wife was gone 30 minutes and came back home to find him dead.  So, why didn't he say something?  Why didn't he talk to her, ask for help?  Was he planning it and waiting for her to be gone?  The logical side assumes everyone is being logical all the time, and fails to understand another's emotions.

As you can see, I have thought a lot about this in the last 2 years.
Parent - By reebs (chicken whisperer) Date 2018-07-30 10:22 AM
I once was on a med mix that created suicidal ideation.  It was fascinating how quickly it came on with the meds and how quickly it dissapeared after the meds. The brain was controlling me, I was not controlling my brain. Possibly like OCD, which I don't have so I can't claim to know.
Parent - By reebs (chicken whisperer) Date 2018-07-30 10:17 AM
I worked for four years on a suicide hotline and I'm married to a therapist (and have other more personal experience that I don't want to talk about on an internet forum).  Suicidal ideation (SI) is often masked and hidden deep.  It makes a lot of people uncomfortable to talk about, and so the person with SI may not talk to those close to them for fear of how they will react. It is judgements like calling suicide "selfish" that continue to stigmatize mental health and make it harder for people who are depressed or have SI to talk about it.  Suicide is a desperate act. It is often impulsive, not planned.  Those who spend time making a plan, etc also have more time to ask for help and disrupt the desire to follow through. And "seeming depressed" is an interesting term.  Depression has a lot of faces, and people wear masks.  Don't under estimate what is going on beneath the surface.

There have been a lot of internet memes recently that say "if you feel suicidal, call me, I'll listen".  They miss the mark.  A person who is suicidal has a very hard time reaching out.  I reposted a FB post a few weeks ago that said this"

"Instead of reaching out to your suicidal friends with a paragraph of “hi don’t kill yourself because we love you”, try reaching out like “hey I got you some Taco Bell we don’t have to talk I just want to come nap with you at your house” or “hey this meme reminds me of you” or “hey I know you haven’t been feeling great can I do your dishes and order you a pizza to make life a little less overwhelming"

What she's saying is true. :hug:

Mental illness is a potentially fatal disease. I wish our culture would treat it like other potentially fatal diseases, that require health services and community support.
Parent - By Gunna [is] Date 2018-07-30 3:45 AM
Gah! Can't believe summer is almost over. Especially since we haven't really had one. :cry: While heat records are falling all over the rest of Europe, we're having the coldest and rainiest summer on record. But at least we had a bit of sun and warm weather during the weekend but now that's over. My family was at the summer cabin and it was so nice to be there with everybody. The youngest kids are now 3 years old and had us all laughing a lot of the time.

I'm on vacation right now and trying to motivate myself to do something useful. I think I need more coffee. : pbbt:
- - By stickywicket Date 2018-07-28 10:03 AM
I can report that tinysticky has officially joined the sticky family in a slightly more dramatic fashion than hoped for and planned. But he's a super cute little dude. Ministicky is doing an awesome job as a big brother. Adult stickys are somewhat sleep deprived.
Parent - By SRoo Date 2018-07-28 10:36 AM
Welcome to love, lil' stickman!  :hug:
Parent - By Zipper [us] Date 2018-07-28 10:37 AM
Congratulations! Welcome, Tinysticky! :hug::hug:
Parent - By judyruns Date 2018-07-28 1:44 PM
Indeed, welcome to the thread, Tinysticky. :happy::cool:
Parent - By swandive Date 2018-07-28 1:45 PM
Congrats!  I want to hear about the dramatic entrance when you get a chance, but for now I'm glad to hear that everyone is doing well.
Parent - By NotSoFast [ca] Date 2018-07-28 4:08 PM
:hug: !!! :grin:
Parent - By flyingkiwi Date 2018-07-28 8:18 PM
Parent - By Arimathea [us] Date 2018-07-28 11:31 PM
Congratulations on tinysticky's arrival! Best wishes to the entire Sticky family, especially new big brother Ministicky.
Parent - By classicsnerd [us] Date 2018-07-29 3:21 PM
:hug::hug::hug: welcome tinysticky! I hope you're (mom) doing well. :hug::hug: "slightly more dramatic" probably wasn't super fun for mom! congratulations to the whole sticky fam.

We call Penelope "little" and have forever, and now refer to impending #2 as "tiny" :laugh:
Parent - By laxrunner Date 2018-07-29 7:37 PM
Parent - By Gunna [is] Date 2018-07-30 3:26 AM
Oh wow, congrats and welcome to tinysticky!! :grin::hug:
Parent - By moonglow9 Date 2018-07-30 8:44 AM
Welcome tinysticky and many congratulations to the entire sticky family :hug:
Parent - By tritri Date 2018-07-30 9:27 AM
:hug::hug:  Congratulations!
Parent - By kelly_v Date 2018-07-30 10:25 AM
congrats! :hug:
Parent - By runningteach [us] Date 2018-07-30 6:28 PM
- - By Arimathea [us] Date 2018-07-28 11:27 PM
Wow, August 1st? That is early. Ours usually go back the second Thursday in August. DS complained bitterly since his birthday is August 17 and so on occasion his birthday fell very close to the first day of school.

"25K" which was actually longer today, good run, I will post a separate race report.

Swannie, if you are interested in relocating to the Spokane area, there is a horrific shortage of contractors here. I went to a Lughnasa celebration with DD yesterday and at least two families were lamenting that they are ready to have something built or repaired, have the money, but cannot find a contractor or other worker. Any interest in coming out to build a deck and steps? Or a house?
Parent - By Gunna [is] Date 2018-07-30 3:47 AM
Yes, that must suck when you're young to have to start school on your birthday. Glad you had a good run!
Up Topic Communities / Women / Waning July Weekend Thread

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